elaby: (Nibelungenlied - gems)
elaby ([personal profile] elaby) wrote2009-04-01 10:43 pm
Entry tags:

Question for the LJ hivemind

I had [livejournal.com profile] caitirin ask this question for me a couple of months ago, but that post got mostly flippant answers, so I thought I'd post again in case anybody missed it.

Have you heard of any culture (in antiquity is what I'm thinking, but I could be wrong) who would dig up the body of a loved one and put it on your doorstep if they were really angry at you? I swear I read this somewhere, but I have the sneaking suspicion it may have involved Anne Rice, and I don't trust anything that woman says as far as I could throw it. Her. Um. You get the idea.

I had a conversation with [livejournal.com profile] _melisande_ to the effect that funereal customs were so important to the Greeks that they wouldn't do this sort of thing, but it sounds like something that might have gone on with the Mesopotamians or Egyptians. Anyone have any thoughts?

This is, incidentally, all for an extended metaphor in a Philip Marlowe thing I'm writing, and Marlowe clearly has a classical education and would know these things, so I want to be accurate.

Thank you, oh great f'list!

[identity profile] janeturenne.livejournal.com 2009-04-02 03:32 am (UTC)(link)
If you're excluding the Greeks on the grounds of "death was too important," you certainly have to exclude the Egyptians as well. Messing with dead bodies was serious business in Ancient Egypt, just about equivalent to murdering the dead person's immortal soul. So, I could see this being Egyptian if it were the corpse you were angry at, but not a third person. On another negative note, it couldn't be the Romans, since they cremated.
I would say the Etruscans, who seem to have had a pretty happy outlook on death based on the funereal relics we have left, only we can't read their language (or maybe they didn't write? I forget) so if they had such a custom we wouldn't know about it. Have you considered the Minoans? They had some ways that were rather unusual even within the ancient world. Though how Marlowe would know anything about the Minoans I'm not sure since Linear B was only just deciphered a few decades ago. So hopefully not them!
Mesopotamia is a possibility, maybe? Wish I could be more definite! You've got me interested, though, I'll have to poke around and see if anything happens to turn up...

[identity profile] elaby.livejournal.com 2009-04-02 11:57 pm (UTC)(link)
You are SO helpful! Thank you! Mesopotamia is definitely a possibility, and I could do something a little general, since Marlowe wouldn't necessarily know exactly which culture it was, but I wouldn't want to have him say anything wrong (like the Egyptians - that didn't occur to me, so thank you for pointing it out!)

[identity profile] templarwolf.livejournal.com 2009-04-02 04:22 am (UTC)(link)
I can't say it's anything I've encountered.

[identity profile] elaby.livejournal.com 2009-04-02 11:57 pm (UTC)(link)
Thanks for considering it, anyway :)

[identity profile] dakegra.livejournal.com 2009-04-02 11:03 pm (UTC)(link)
hmm. It definitely sounds familiar, but I can't think what it is, off the top of my head. Will do some digging.

[identity profile] elaby.livejournal.com 2009-04-03 12:00 am (UTC)(link)
Thank you very much! Any digging is greatly appreciated if you want to go into it :)

[identity profile] dakegra.livejournal.com 2009-04-03 12:05 pm (UTC)(link)
I asked on Twitter but didn't have much luck (other than calling it 'excavenge')

I did find reference to something called famadihana, but that's more digging up your relatives to have a dance with them and to rewrap the bodies in fresh cloth
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Famadihana

still looking though. Have asked the lj hivemind on the basis that my friendslist doesn't entirely overlap with yours, and there are a few people on there who may be able to answer...

[identity profile] elaby.livejournal.com 2009-04-03 10:26 pm (UTC)(link)
You're the best! Thank you so much :) That link looks fascinating, thank you.

[identity profile] nalsa.livejournal.com 2009-04-03 01:00 pm (UTC)(link)
[livejournal.com profile] dakegra sent me.

Well, it's also a sort-of modern day phenomenon; animal rights extremists (http://www.guardian.co.uk/uk/2006/may/12/animalwelfare.topstories3) stole a body and wrote a letter to the family demanding they shut down a farm in return for the body.

[identity profile] elaby.livejournal.com 2009-04-03 10:27 pm (UTC)(link)
Whoa O_O Thank you for the link!

[identity profile] shriker-tam.livejournal.com 2009-04-03 02:22 pm (UTC)(link)
also here via [livejournal.com profile] dakegra.

Digging up your own relative because you're mad at someone else seems unlikely - it seems disrespectful to the dead. Digging up the offender's relative seems more likely. Sorry, I can't think of any such practice though. I did once read about a place where dead people were dried out and sort of mummified, and then kept in the attic for good luck, but I can't find it online. I think it was on some pacific island or something like that.

[identity profile] elaby.livejournal.com 2009-04-03 10:28 pm (UTC)(link)
Sorry, that's what I meant - digging up a loved one of the offender. But your comment was still helpful, thank you!